Episode 260

GIFS & Videos for Effective Customer Learning

Customer education is a must-have for a lot of businesses these days, especially software companies. But reading thick manuals and wordy passages of jargon is no one’s idea of a good time. 

So what’s the key to great customer education?

For this episode, we look back at an older conversation we had with Greg Mead. Back then, he was Senior Instructional Designer at ClickUp, so we talked about ClickUp’s approach to instructional videos and the power of GIFs in learning design. Since the episode first went out, Greg has moved on to become a Learning Experience Designer at FloQast.

You’ll hear a bit about Greg’s background in video, how ClickUp experimented with different learning mediums, his advice for making engaging videos, and the best times to use GIFs.

Learning points from the episode include:

  • 00:00 - 01:30 One tip for improving how you use GIFs or short videos
  • 01:30 - 03:33 GIF vs video: How to decide what media to use
  • 03:33 - 05:09 Why should we lean into visual mediums?
  • 05:09 - 07:30 The tipping point that took Greg from written instructions to video
  • 07:30 - 09:21 Continuous improvement in video
  • 09:21 - 11:50 How to make sure the videos are engaging and helpful
  • 11:50 - 15:05 How GIFs help to communicate advanced concepts
  • 15:05 - 16:53 Greg’s background as a video creator
  • 16:53 - 21:57 Speed round questions
  • 21:57 - 26:04 How to connect with Greg
  • 26:04 - 26:50 Greg’s final take

Important links and mentions:

Transcript
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Good morning, good evening, good afternoon, wherever you are, wherever you're watching from today. We're

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going to be going back in the archives today with Greg Mead. We're going to

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be talking about using images, GIFs and video

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for customer education. Now, if you're not in customer education, don't turn away because

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there are so many good things you can learn about using these

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mediums to allow you to better communicate, to share what you

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need with your audience. Whether that's internal or external doesn't matter.

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GIFs, short videos, there's so much information that can be shared in those

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moving images that is really powerful. So let's go ahead and dive

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in with Greg Mead. Greg

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Mead, man, he is doing so many things. He's a father of two girls.

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Second one is on the way or is here. It should be. We'll see.

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We'll talk to him about that. He's a senior instructional designer at ClickUp. He's

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passionate about learning and developing delightful learning experiences

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for his audience, especially at scale. And he's gained a ton

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of knowledge on his journey in his career and has brought him to where he

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is today. So we're so excited to be able to talk with Greg today. Please

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help me welcome Greg Mead to the Visual Lounge.

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Hey, Matt. Thank you. You know, I realized when I went

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through the bio that it's probably timing wise, I guess you have,

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probably child number two is here. Yeah, I am on

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paternity leave right now. My, my daughter Ashley was born on November

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11th. Oh, congratulations and thank you for taking time to

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meet with me of all people in your time off. So we'll go through this.

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Greg, as we always like to start, we always like to kind of get practical

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first. So is there a tip that you could give our audience

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that would help them improve using gifs and video

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in their work? What would you say to them? I would say

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you always have to really start somewhere. So

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go ahead and give it a shot, see how things work. And if it doesn't

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work, you can always try to improve it and try to make it look

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smooth and, you know, and, and try to make it

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go from the eye of the learner and of the person

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who's consuming your content. What would they like to see?

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What would be good for them? You know, quick movements, probably not

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so much, you know, slow, nice, consistent,

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concise and easy to follow movements

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are probably most, most accepted and really

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positively viewed. You know, it's, it's interesting to say that because

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I, and I refer to this study a lot, but at Techsmith we did a

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study about why people basically their preferences about viewing video and that

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was one of the big things. So I love that tip. Don't think about yourself,

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think about what they want. And what they want is to be able to do

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something they want to follow along and why zippy is good, but sometimes

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bring it back. And that, that was the number one reason, like people kept watching

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because it was easy to follow along. So it's just so important,

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good audio in that and you got a winning combination, I think.

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Yeah, yeah. One of the things that we've seen, we get these surveys on

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ClickUp University all the time and everybody says how

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easy it is to follow, how clear the images and the video

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are and you know, how much of a delight it was. So it's really

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fulfilling to see that when, you know, because we have such a

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massive scale of learners every single month. So it's

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just really cool to be able to get that validation through all

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these surveys that you see. Yeah. Especially when you're learning software tools

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and if you're like, ah, I don't know where to start, it's easy to get

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frustrated. I've been on that path before with tools and it's like, man, I don't,

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I'm just not going to keep using it. I'm done. Right. And that's obviously a

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key. Greg, let me ask you this because we want to talk about GIFs and

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we want to talk about videos and you've. I know you've been doing a lot,

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as you mentioned, ClickUp University, we've talked multiple times kind of offline

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about of the things that you're doing at a high level

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when you're kind of approaching creating content, learning content

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particularly. There's obviously a lot of decisions that go into the

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deciding which media you're going to use. So I'm curious for you,

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what are some of the criteria that lead you to decide

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either like, hey, a GIF or gif, if we want to have that

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debate, which we don't, a GIF is good. Or if

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it should be a full video. Do you have any kind of like top of

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the head heuristics that you use or anything like that?

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Yeah, well, for me it was a lot of, well, a lot of guess

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and check. I just kept thinking, okay, I've got this content and

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this message that I need to convey. I can do it quickly with

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a GIF and just say, here's a, here's a quick task that you can show.

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Here's a quick action you can do. Whereas a video is

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more, I mean it's not super duper long, I don't recommend like really

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long videos, but something that's a little bit shorter. But it,

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a video has a more of a journey that it takes you on. It's not

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just one single thing all the time technically.

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And so what I like about the GIFs is hey, you want to

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learn how to apply a template? Watch this GIF real quick. It's 15

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seconds and it repeats so you can always just capture it

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and it's on, it's on a loop and so that's pretty nice. Whereas a video,

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you watch it, you can fast forward, rewind and all that, all

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that good stuff. So for you and your

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group that you work with, I've got to imagine especially because you

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are working at such a large scale, right? There are so many different

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types of learners who are going to come through that content. Their experience

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levels probably are. It's like a great chasm, right?

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Like there's some that are. I've never used anything like this before ever

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to like probably pretty technical in advance.

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When you're starting to break down like those decision points on are there

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considerations that you have that you think about showing something

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quick versus that idea that they're taking them on a little bit of a journey

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with the video. But like, even compared to like hey, let's use

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media, let's use a gif, let's use video versus just text

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which and I don't want to say text is just universal but there are

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some trade offs there. Like to text, you know, it's probably from a

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localization standpoint you can edit text easier. Like there's all

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these things but so why, why lean into these visual

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media for us? I'll just say it this way. I

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started with the text based learning because I

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was the only person at ClickUp University. I was the only person at ClickUp

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creating the university at the time. So I was either doing video

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scripts. We had also had a creative team that we had in house that we

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utilized but they wanted the creative team to do all the

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video tutorial walkthroughs at first. And so I said, you know what? I'm

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going to do text and text and image and GIF

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type of content in ClickUp University because

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it is so easy for me to go in and update when I need

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to. And ClickUp at the time it was every

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single week we were shipping new features and it was just like

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there's a lot I had to keep going into the onboarding content

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and changing that periodically as well. So I just kept thinking to

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myself, if I was doing this, you know, full time, just by

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myself, what would be the easiest route? Would it be

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text based learning or would it be, you know, updating

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videos that have a little bit more of a production aspect

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to them? And the answer to me was text and

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GIFs. That was the easiest, quickest way to kind of

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update the product, make sure it was updated to

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the right specs. Yeah, I mean it makes sense, right? Like if you got to

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go fast, makes a lot of sense. So on this journey,

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obviously you've switched to some degree though, right? Because you're doing a lot more

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video and gif. What has been the tipping point to bring you to that?

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Well, there's a few things. Probably the biggest tipping point was back to those

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surveys. It's always about customer feedback. Right?

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ClickUp is very much about product led growth. And

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so we are as well at the customer education side of the, or

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we call it customer enablement at ClickUp. And we got all these surveys and

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people are like, more video please. Like, we love your text.

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However, we would just like a video on this topic.

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And so that's when we're like, okay, where can we add video?

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And so where I came in later is we had this initiative

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to do more use case based content.

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And with use case based content, it was specific, like I'm

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a marketer and I need to learn how to do campaigns

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in ClickUp. How am I going to do that? And so we would take them

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on a journey. We had multiple modalities. We had an E

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learning course that we created that had text,

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images, GIFs and some video, like setup

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aspects for video. And then we also had video

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courses that we created that were just. Here is

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an example of a walkthrough demo and just so people, if they wanted to see

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it, they could just watch it. And so we were actually seeing more and

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more people kind of lean towards that direction.

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Along with the surveys that we were receiving about video like all the

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time. It was just really kind of a directive for us to say, okay,

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time to start doing more video on our side. Well, I

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love that, I love that you're listening to your customers, you're hearing what they're saying

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they want and you were responding to that. Amazing. But there's reality of

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then you had to do it, you had to put it into practice, those

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things. So I'm curious if someone's maybe at that same point they're like, hey, we,

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we know we, our customers want More video. We want to do more video. What

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would you say to someone who's like, okay, I need to get past that tipping

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point, but I also need it to scale. What advice would

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you, you give to someone like that? Well, let me just

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start off with this. At ClickUp, one of our core values is to grow

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1% every day. And the way that I

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found that embodied within me was somebody once

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challenged me to do more motion graphic

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video, more evergreen style video

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that didn't happen to have all the product screens

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inside of it, but it had concepts, it was, it was more

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conceptual, it was, hey, let me do some definitions for you.

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Let me show you some value. Find out how you can do

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that on a video and then, you know, screen share

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where you need to screen share. But just know that when you show a

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screen that has a very limited shelf life.

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And so motion graphic videos, I've leaned in on this the

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last couple of months. I've just been creating all types of like,

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really fun and I love them with a passion. Now I

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can't go without using Camtasia because now I know how to do these motion

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graphic videos. I'm like using the motion, the,

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you know, just the motion paths. I'm doing custom animations

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and, and I'm adding different shapes and, and different, you know,

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elements and things like that. And it's a good way to do it because it's

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evergreen. Because I can create these videos and I

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probably won't even need to redo them for a year or two.

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Yeah. And that's a great shelf lifey you're getting a year or two versus like

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every week. Oh my gosh, I can't imagine every week. I love that

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idea. Talking about create evergreen content. Take these

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bigger kind of conceptual ideas and breaking them down versus

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just the, the step by step how tos. And I'm guessing is that so

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is GIFs. Is that where the step more step by step, like one step,

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two step, maybe three steps come in or, or are you still

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leaning heavy to text there? We're. We actually do a

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combination. So I will show and we use

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articulate rise. And I will show like a text image

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block and it'll say, okay, if you want to go here and

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do this, follow these steps. 1, 2, 3. And then on the

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right there's a video of that same step path

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in those directions. I want to change gears just a little bit.

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Still talking about videos and gifs, I'm caught on this idea

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that you heard from your audience and you listened to them and I think that's

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such an important quality in an organization. Right. You've probably got companies

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you've, you have dealt with and felt like they're not listening to me as a

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customer. So I love that. But I'm thinking about like from an

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engagement standpoint. Here you are, you've got this audience who's saying,

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please give us more video. You're creating these conceptual evergreen

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concepts. How do you make sure that. And we could

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define engagement probably in a lot of ways, but how do you make sure these

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videos are engaging them at that user level so

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that they're gonna sit through it, they're gonna watch it, they're gonna get the information

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that one, you know they need, but two, you also,

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as much as you know they need it, you might have to convince them a

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little bit that it's worth the time. Right. Because even if it's a two minute,

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three minute video that sometime someone has to go, they have to be in the

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right place to find it. They have to have been willing to click the play

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button. They have to have been willing to actually focus and not

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do all the other stuff that's on this other screen, you know, so any thoughts

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on that and how you make sure you're moving

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videos and graphics and are helping engage your end

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learner? Well, let's, let's start by defining

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the types of learning that we'll use video for.

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Yeah. First off, we are big proponents of

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onboarding because that's our biggest, that's our biggest thing

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is we have the most registrants. We have

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10,000 learners a month on our university and

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7,500 of them are going directly to

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our onboarding videos. And they want something short, they want something

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snappy, they want something to the point and clear.

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And so we've seen that in the surveys, they've asked for that.

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And so what I would say is when you're talking about video,

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really that's a great place to have more video

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evergreen conceptual terms and concepts. Screen

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sharing walkthroughs like skill based onboarding, how you

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can get people up to speed and confident enough to, to use the

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system to be a little dangerous, but also just to be

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happy. We've gotten so many people saying, you know, it was super

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clear, it was easy to follow and we really loved the

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pace. What I did in these videos was I actually, my

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colleague recorded them and screen shared them recording

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and then I went through and did all the back end production.

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And so we would zoom in on certain areas just to make it super clear

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whenever what I found is when things are zoomed in on and there's call

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outs and there's really good graphics and things for people to,

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to review, they'll stay engaged. And to your point,

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we have our videos linked in Wistia. We're seeing

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95% view rates. Wow. Or

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along those lines. So it's pretty cool to see like people

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will click on it, they'll usually watch it most of the time all the way

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to the end. Because these videos are no more than three minutes long

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typically some are a little bit longer, but Some are like 90

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seconds. Some are 3 minutes, some are 7 minutes

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depending on the topic. But really the

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onboarding component is really the best case for video. When

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you have more advanced concepts. That's where gifts come in.

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Because like I was saying, use cases we have

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and more advanced content. Like for us there's

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this concept or this feature called tasks and

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multiple lists. Well, that's an agile feature that people love,

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but people don't know how to use it. Or relationships. People don't know

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how to, or what the importance of relationships are.

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And then they don't know how to connect tasks to create these

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relationships and how it affects them and how could actually help

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them to be more productive because they can go in between

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these different tasks that are related immediately.

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And so it's just, it's good to see those on video and we really

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do show a lot of those on GIFs. Like you can get it if you

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go through our course that's very GIF focused

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on relationships. So you're giving the

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advanced users a gift. Sorry,

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sorry. The dad in me couldn't help it. I'm sorry. But,

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but I love that. Right, there's that you, you've created this delineation as

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a SaaS focused company onboarding, getting people into the tool,

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getting them going is super important. And not to say that

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those other things aren't, but it makes sense to me that looking at,

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hey, I want you to come in and if you're at ground zero, know nothing.

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Video is a quick way to kind of ramp up the knowledge, ramp, ramp up

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the understanding. Like you said, I've used tools that have this idea of

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relationships and it's like it took me so long to wrap my head around

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that what is this thing? And I can see how video would be really helpful

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with that. But then the GIFs showing how it works, like how do you

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connect these things together in a way that is actually functional? So I

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love that. Next question. Greg, for you, I'm curious because

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you're obviously been doing a lot of video lately. You've moved from that

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writing, doing stuff to more video work. And

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I'm curious for you, what's your background journey been like as a video

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creator? Because I'm thinking someone's watching saying, yeah, but man, Greg's

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awesome, but he's probably always done video. So I'm curious, what's your

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background in terms of going from like

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maybe not using video in this work to using it a lot? Is it something

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that you, you've always been doing or is this something you're self taught? How, how'd

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you get good at this? Yeah, so I would say it's, it was self

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taught. So just backtracking a little bit about 10 years ago,

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just a little tidbit about me is I love to sing and I love music.

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And my buddy was actually looking to get into a video

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production as a company, as a product. He wanted to do music

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videos and he wanted to do wedding videos, wedding

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videography. That's kind of where the passion came in for video

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creation. And he and I created this

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video, kind of a silly video that actually almost went viral.

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And it was me singing with arms wide open by Creed.

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And a lot of people were like, is this guy serious

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or is he joking? Because if he's serious, I feel sad for him, right?

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And so it's really funny because I actually,

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I did it as a complete joke, but people thought I was serious and then

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it got caught up on a blog and people thought, man, people who

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didn't know me and didn't know the inside joke that I had with my friend,

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they just thought I was this sad, pathetic person and it was

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really funny. But that was actually just to get back to video.

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That was a video that we did. And I was like, you know, I love

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making video, I love doing this. So I started doing more and more

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like music style videos. But then I didn't really have a.

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I didn't really have a way to do this for my professional career. At

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the time I was in sales, I was not in customer education or

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training. And what happened was once I was training

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customers, I was in customer education. While I was at

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Mavenlink, we were able to get Camtasia. And that's

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when the magic happened for me. I was finally able to get

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back to making some video and having some fun there.

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But again wanted to make these delightful experiences.

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But you know, for me, I look back, I think I

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watched one of your previous episodes and they were saying like,

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you know, you look back at the videos that you first create and you kind

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of cringe a little bit. That, that's me with Mavenlink.

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I just kind of created these long videos. They were an hour

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long, they were very dry. Like how is

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this even engaging? And so just going on through the career, through my

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career, you know, I was making these videos but I knew I wanted to make

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them better, you know. And then when getting to click up,

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it's like practicing and practicing and practicing, getting this video

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creation down, video production down and then

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knowing my audience, like my audience is a bunch of really

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smart, really tech savvy individuals.

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So they want to, they want to get to the point. And so for me

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I was self taught. So what I, what I did is I would just actually

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look at Camtasia tutorials or I would, I would review,

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I would just go in and try it myself and practice the

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zooming and panning and things like that and to where I could make a

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really good video now and, and make it

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branded and everything. So I would say that I was really self taught

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with that. But over the years I've also

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had more access to better things that complement Camtasia.

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Right. So, so for instance, I do use Snagit to put

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into a Camtasia video at times. So sometimes there's like a,

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a gif that's going at the same time of me talking through a

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video. I also use Canva as another

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tool that you just, you create different designs and

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motion graphics and things like that that you can add to

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Camtasia. And then also Figma on

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our ClickUp we use Figma all the time because we have custom

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branded assets that I then take, I put

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into sometimes Canva or just go straight into to

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Camtasia and we use those. So I've been able to create this

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really great custom branded,

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effectively produced video for my customers.

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So it's been a lot of fun and I've like just found this passion for

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it. And even lately I've been just like, I'm even on paternity.

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I'm like, man, I want to keep going. So I'm like looking at how I

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can do just other, you know, I can just practice different

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techniques and, and different things. Yeah.

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So while I'm, while I'm off. So it's kind of a way to grow

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1% me. I love that journey. I think we all have those journeys

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and we definitely all have those videos we look back at and just be like,

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that was not. I even make some of those today. I mean, let's be Fair.

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I still occasionally crank one out, and I'm like, oh, gosh, what was I. What

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was I doing so well, Greg, I. I have enjoyed this part of our

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conversation, but it is time we're going to move into our speedrun questions. For those

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who are new to the show, Speedrun questions are meant to be quick

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questions with quick answers. So let's go ahead and dive in.

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You know, that was made in Camtasia. That's, you know, that's the secret.

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All right, Greg. For those that don't know, we also roll a die to determine.

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I've got. I've got 12 questions here, and I don't know what we're going to

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ask, so let's go ahead and switch over to our dice cam. Looking fancy with

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the angles, and I found a die that actually looks decent on camera, and that

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is an 11. Okay, Greg, you had to pick an

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image that represents you. What is

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that? Image of man. An image that represents

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me could be anything. You know, I would

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just say somebody laughing because I love to have a good

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time and very, very humorful,

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you know, love to laugh and. And sometimes when people hear my laugh,

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they'll start laughing. Yes. A good time. I was. I'm glad it's

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not the. The cat. I'm hanging their poster because that would be. That tell the

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very different story. No, so. All right,

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Greg, next. Next. Die roll. Because like I said, these are quick and fast. Here

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we go. Nice. And it's a five.

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Okay, this is a little bit more serious one. If you could acquire

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any new skill, what would it

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be and why? Any new skill. I

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would love to learn how to code. I know that ChatGPT

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is out there, but still, for me, I think coding would be something

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that would be an unbelievably valuable thing for

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me. It would help me create more video and

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integrate more content into websites and things like that.

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And that was one of the things at ClickUp as well, that was really, sorely

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needed that I did not. I could not provide at the time.

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And still. So that would be something that I would want to learn.

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Super valuable. Definitely a good skill. Good choice. All right, we

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got one more die roll. Here we go. What's it going to be? So you

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got to look at the dot and at the dots at the bottom, and that's

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the number. So it's a nine. Thinking about your career so far?

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Probably got a lot of career left, just like me. But what's one

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thing that you are most proud of? Your career so far?

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One of the most Things that. One of the one thing I'm proud of with

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my career so far, I would say it was the monetized

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certifications that we built. I know it

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has video in it, but it was one of the certificates that we

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built at mavenlink that we were able to monetize.

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And I just remember seeing that first order

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that I didn't have to go in and, and search for. It was just

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a, it was just a self serve

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order of a certificate and it just felt really

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great. But you know, now that I'm thinking about it, if I

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can do one more, it would be winning that Golden Skillet. You know,

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when we want it, give some context. What's, what is a golden skillet? So for

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those that don't know, Golden. Skillet is like the, it's just

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an award. That Skill Jar, the LMS that we use at ClickUp,

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they have this annual conference every year called Connect

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and they give out these golden skillets

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because they, they show they display excellence in customer education.

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And it was really cool because when we started day

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one at ClickUp, we got Skill Jar. I was so excited. And

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then we launched it within about 100 days and, and

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then after that we just kept building on it and building on it and building

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on it and we got in touch with Skill Jar and then

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they actually awarded us the excellence in customer

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innovation at. Which is what we got this

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the skillet for. It was just really great. It was so much fun. It

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was such a highlight of my career just being up on

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that stage. That was last year, right? That was

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Last year, yeah. 20, 20, 22 and I got to see that. So yeah, it

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was, it was a great moment. So. Well, Greg, it has been just a pleasure

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with you as always, something I'm always looking forward to whenever I get a chance.

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But before we wrap up, if someone wanted to connect with you, they want to

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see maybe some of the work that you've been doing what you're talking about. Where

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can they find you? You can connect with me on LinkedIn,

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you know,

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LinkedIn.comn/gd

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mead gd m e a D. And yeah, that,

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that's a great place. Let's connect there. And I've also got a YouTube but

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I'm still working on adding a few things to the YouTube here. I

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may, I may start doing like side projects of motion graphic

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videos on the side for different people

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and companies. And so if you're interested in that,

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feel free to connect. Absolutely. Well, Greg,

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as we wrap up every show, of course we're always so grateful for our guests,

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but we like to ask them, what is their final take? So, Greg,

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what's your final take from this episode? Final take. Listen

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to your customers. Video for onboarding

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content and evergreen content and

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GIFs for more advanced content,

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text based content or harder, more advanced concepts.

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Perfect. I love it. Nice and concise, to the point, like, very

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directive. It's good advice. You know it is. Well, Greg, thank you so much

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for joining me today in the Visual Lounge. Thank you.

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You bet. All right, everybody, so you heard it. Look,

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you've got these great tools at your disposal to help you to make better

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content for your customer's journey. Whether they're onboarding or whether they're getting to

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that certification. You can use video and GIFs to enhance the message that you

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want to give. And as Greg said it, we didn't ask him to say this.

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I'm so grateful that he said it, though. If you're looking for a tool to

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help you do that, Camtasia, hands down, is a great way.

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Now, look, I know I work for the company and you're probably saying, well, Matt,

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you work for the company. You have to say it. I can guarantee that

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if I ever leave Techsmith, I will go and ask

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for Camtasia in that job. Because guess what, it is such a valuable tool

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to help you make videos, images, especially when it comes to customer education. You're

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connecting with outbound, you're talking about software. There's this beautiful blend of things

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that it can do. Then you bring in snagit, you bring in the asset library,

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you bring in audit. You've got this great kind of compounding effect

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of these great tools. So with that said, if you've got comments, you got feedback

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you want to leave for us, make sure you email me at the visual

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lounge@techsmith.com of course, you can always like and subscribe the

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YouTube channel, follow on your favorite podcasting platform

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anywhere. We're there. Spotify, Apple. Well, Google's going away,

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but it'll be YouTube. We are everywhere that you might want to be and listen

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to us. And we appreciate, of course, everyone taking time out of their busy days

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to give us a little chance. There'll be a voice in your ear.

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So, you know, Greg mentioned this and so he said it so well,

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they have this motto at ClickUp, get 1% better every day. We ascribe to

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that here at the Visual Lounge. So make sure you take a little time to

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level up every single day. Thanks, everybody.

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About the Podcast

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The Visual Lounge
Discussions about the power of visuals and videos and how to make them even better.

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About your host

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Matthew Pierce

Matthew Pierce, Learning & Video Ambassador from TechSmith Corporation, has created videos for learning and marketing for over a decade. He is the lead behind TechSmith Academy, a free platform teaching video and image creation for business, which has been used by tens of thousands of users. He is the host of The Visual Lounge Podcast from TechSmith, which streams live on Youtube and LinkedIn weekly. Matthew is a regular speaker at multiple learning and development-focused conferences and is a regular contributor to various training publications. Connect with him on LinkedIn.